Building Tiny, Ultra Low Power PCs

July 22, 2008

In previous posts, I've talked about building your own desktop PC, and building your own home theater PC. I'm still very much in love with that little HTPC I built. Not only does it have a modern dual-core CPU, and fantastic high-definition capable integrated video -- it's an outstanding general purpose media sharing server, too. But the real punchline is that I eventually got that box down to an insanely low 44 watts at idle. That's in the ballpark for a powerful laptop, and far better than your garden variety desktop PC, which will draw somewhere between 100 to 200 watts of power.

44 watts is impressive, but what if you want to build a PC that uses even less power -- radically less?

That's when you turn to something like AMD's Geode platform in the Nano-ITX form factor. It uses five watts of power at idle. That's almost ten times less than my HTPC build I was so proud of!

Nano-ITX motherboard

This is the JetWay J8F9 AMD Geode LX800 motherboard. I can't say "this is actual size" with a straight face without knowing the size and aspect ratio of your monitor, but it's probably darn close. The actual dimensions are just under five inches on each side. It may not look like much, but consider the specs:

  • 500 Mhz AMD x86 Geode LX 800 CPU
  • 200 pin SO-DIMM memory slot, 1 GB DDR-400 max
  • Two ATA-100 drive connections
  • mini-PCI expansion slot
  • CompactFlash memory card slot
  • onboard audio / VGA / fast ethernet / USB

This thing is, for all intents and purposes, a complete, standalone x86 PC that fits in the palm of your hand and sips five watts of power. Well, assuming you have an enormous hand.

You will need memory and a storage device, of course. You could pick up a laptop hard drive, but another clever thing about this board is that it allows you to use a cheap CompactFlash card as your storage medium -- for the optimal low power, no moving parts install.

  1. AMD Geode LX 800 Nano ITX Motherboard/CPU Combo $154
  2. 512MB 200-pin SO-DIMM DDR-400 $20
  3. 4GB compact flash card $14
  4. 12vdc AC/DC external wall wart $18

So we can put together our own tiny utility PC for right at 200 bucks. Not bad. Unbox it, snap in the memory and CF card, plug in the wall wart, and you're ready to install and boot your operating system of choice. It's that simple.

Naturally, you won't get barn-burning performance, but if you remember the Pentium II 300 Mhz systems of yesteryear, you'll know what to expect. You may recall those now-ancient boxes were still able to do some pretty amazing things in their day. I would not build an ultra-lower power PC assuming it will be tolerable for day-to-day web browsing and email reading, unless you're comfortable using text mode or command-line interfaces exclusively.

This must be a market segment JetWay specializes in; they have a surprisingly large number of Mini-ITX motherboards to choose from. I don't think you'll find anything more power-efficient than the Geode LX 800 model, though, but there are some lesser expensive choices that get close. Lots of variety!

If the 5" x 5" profile of the Nano-ITX is far too large for your tastes, how do you feel about Pico-ITX? It's even smaller at 10cm x 7.2cm.

picoitx-epia-px10000.jpg

I've been following the ultra low power, tiny form factor PC segment for quite a few years now. With the emergence of Intel's Atom and "netbooks" like the ASUS Eee, it's a segment that is dangerously close to becoming mainstream. If you're interested, mini-itx.com is still one of the best sources of hands-on reviews, information, and community projects. It's fun stuff.

What could you do with a tiny, highly efficient x86 PC that boots up in under a minute?

Posted by Jeff Atwood
97 Comments

It's actually 20% bigger than normal size on my screen!

Jonathan Drain's Dungeons Dragons Blog on July 23, 2008 2:00 AM

What's all the fuss. The PC/104 and PC/104+ form factors (3.55 3.775) have been around since for years in the embedded systems market.

Personally I'd rather have a 600MHz ARM based iMX-32 or XScale device running well under a Watt. Of course though it is about software support I guess. Plenty of open source code including Linux that will run on ARM though.

Clifford on July 23, 2008 2:42 AM

Hey, I am building a Pico-ITX for my car and I did go the route of inexpensive flash car but the problem is I found out that the write speeds on the cheap ones make using its impossible. (with times of 1.5mbs write... it makes you think something is broken). now the read times of these carts can still hit blazing (like 250mbs read) so starting windows is nothing, but click from folder to folder and installing apps SUCK. so don't cheap out on the CF card. I got one of those high quality ones and it did bump the write rate to 10mbs which is far more acceptable, and the read rates max out at 300mbs ( i used a sata to cf adapter).

gltovar on July 23, 2008 2:43 AM

... I meant i.MX31

Clifford on July 23, 2008 2:44 AM

2W - http://72.51.37.17/

Wolfgang on July 23, 2008 2:54 AM

Like many others, I've a WRT54GL running Linux. It draws ~8 watts, is my asterisk server, my wireless router, and my network gateway.

dnm on July 23, 2008 2:54 AM

Great post as usual!

I've got my eye on the MicroClient Sr., by NorhTec. 1W, fanless, 500MHz CPU, integrated MPEG2 decoding... although I am more interested in it as a headless command line only server. It looks like shipping is kind of expensive and I'm not sure if it comes with a power supply or not. But the price still seems pretty good. My only reservation is that it only has one Ethernet port.

http://www.norhtec.com/products/mcsr/index.html


krog on July 23, 2008 3:33 AM

Captcha bypass test.

MustLive on July 23, 2008 4:19 AM

Just noted that this takes 12 V DC input. I have 3 of those portable 12 V battery things that can boost your car if the battery dies. They have a 12 V output through the cigarette lighter attachment. I also have a solar charger that can charge them.

What I would like to do would be to have a computer that ran from those batteries.
- It would avoid the 20% loss when converting from AC to DC.
- It would avoid using AC power at all for the computer, probably the monitor would be plugged into AC.
- I could charge one battery while running the computer from another battery, then swap them.

N. Velope on July 23, 2008 4:25 AM

I've just built an desktop PC similar to your HTPC. I find it pretty quiet compared to my old P4, and it's perfect for the things I use to do with my computer at home, so thank you for the idea!
Now I've got a much more efficient PC for 200€ more or less

Alberto on July 23, 2008 4:28 AM

I'm using a very similar board (ALIX 3C.3) as my main desktop computer. I run a browser on it locally, and for everything else I connect to a colocated server. Overall, it works great; the only downside is that it only supports a single monitor, and then just VGA.

Name on July 23, 2008 5:14 AM

I've put a Mini ITX PC in my car to play music. It's running a modified XP with some XP embedded components patched into it to enable Enhanced Write Filter and Minlogin so boot-up times are shorter and disk writes are cached in ram. It's booting off CompactFlash with a little app that I wrote that searches any USB keys plugged in for music and queues them up.

The project was a lot of fun and I learned a bit about electronics too as I realised there weren't off the shelf components that I could use. It's a great learning experience if you have the time and drive to try something out!

Dave H on July 23, 2008 6:06 AM

Hmm. I noticed in the user reviews for this $75 Intel Atom motherboard:

http://is.gd/11if

I got this yesterday with 2gb of ram and loaded Mac OS X Leopard and ran great.

A mini-itx system might be an interesting choice for building a frankenmac to play with, too..

Jeff Atwood on July 23, 2008 6:23 AM

Here in Switzerland, there is a company called PC Engines (http://www.pcengines.ch). You may want to check out their ALIX boards.

I have myself the old (end-of-life) WRAP board running m0n0wall (http://m0n0.ch/wall/) on it.

BTW: I'm in no way associated with the two projects mentioned above.

Tini on July 23, 2008 6:35 AM

Check out this as well. Not really similar as you can't fiddle with the OS or anything. But if you need a low power consumption + grandma proof PC, I'd get this:
http://www.cherrypal.com/

joon on July 23, 2008 6:47 AM

I can't wait till the CherryPal comes out!!! Hopefully the market niche will expand, gain a foothold, and prices will continue to drop drop drop.

meme on July 23, 2008 6:55 AM

What would I do?
list ;o)
* Run an asterisk box
* Check email and do an audio notification of interesting ones
* Run a flat panel as a picture frame and every third pic show a
slide of the weather forecast it gets from the web.
* Monitor Amber Alerts (and show them on above mentioned monitor)

More to come when I think of them.

Keng on July 23, 2008 6:55 AM

I can't wait till the CherryPal comes out!!!

Wow, their 2 watt claim is impressive. Not so impressive is the way their website links to a direct IP address when I click through to products..

Jeff Atwood on July 23, 2008 7:05 AM

http://www.theinquirer.net/gb/inquirer/news/2008/07/23/green-computing-broke-cherry

Heres another tiny PC

Andrew on July 23, 2008 7:06 AM

MAME?

Jukebox or Network Media Player? (stereo sound)

Adam on July 23, 2008 7:11 AM

Surely you can't say actual size without knowing the user's dpi, not their screen size or aspect ratio.

Ambrose Nankivell on July 23, 2008 7:11 AM

I use a Netgear NSLU2 with Unslung firmware. You can then run pretty much anything you need to on it, like print server, basic webserver and DNS stuff. Not enough juice for an HTPC server though.

James L on July 23, 2008 7:13 AM

Can't let a discussion of tiny computers go without mentioning the slug :
a href=http://www.nslu2-linux.org/http://www.nslu2-linux.org//a">http://www.nslu2-linux.org//a">http://www.nslu2-linux.org/http://www.nslu2-linux.org//a

Certainly not a desktop, though. Decent as a light home server.

AndyL on July 23, 2008 7:23 AM

http://www.fit-pc.com

Kent on July 23, 2008 7:27 AM

Put a group of them together, and it looks like a pretty good fit for web crawling.

Chris on July 23, 2008 7:28 AM

Have you seen the Debian based Bubba Two file and print server? It uses a 333 MHz PowerPC CPU and 256 MB ram and draw 7-12 Watts, depending on the number of hard disks, all in a compact and quiet box. (http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS3110315320.html)

C.M on July 23, 2008 7:32 AM

I built a small PC using an Artigo kit. I use it as a Lotus Domino/Sametime server.

http://www.iminstant.com/iminstant/iminstant.nsf/d6plinks/CTYR-7DD4EC

I did some load testing on it, and it works just fine.
http://www.iminstant.com/iminstant/iminstant.nsf/d6plinks/CTYR-7DTK3F

It plays Divxs great and also does Netflix streaming really well. The only processor issue I have found with it is playing BBC iPlayer content. The BBC(MS) DRM really slows things down.

Good to see more choices coming out from more vendors. I read the other day about one that fits into the wall socket, so you don't even see it.

Carl tyler on July 23, 2008 7:33 AM

Not to mention all of this is just plain fun for the geekiness of it.

Practicality on July 23, 2008 7:35 AM

I guess I know what my next project will be. :)

Do they make nice, small form factor enclosures for these types of boards? This would make a really nice file server for at home since you could just tuck it away somewhere and let it go.

Justin Bennett on July 23, 2008 7:42 AM

It's a bit difficult for me to wrap my head around the phrase 10 times smaller. I assume that you mean 1/10th the size. I do hear/read your terminology several places, but it just feels less clear to me than my stated interpretation. There, I feel better now.

I look forward to reading your articles every day.

Les on July 23, 2008 7:43 AM

Would be quite nice to have a small quick launching computer for doing minimal things, checking email, internet, MAME cabinet.

Also have you seen the Gumstix computer?

Gumstix website - http://www.gumstix.com/
Wikipedia on the Gumstix - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gumstix

Cory on July 23, 2008 7:51 AM

mini-itx.com has been around a long time, and I have bought from them in the past. However, their shipping charges are completely ludicrous: Shipping costs from the UK to the Netherlands is €27 for a €56 case I looked at recently.

Also, I tried asking them a question a couple of times and actually NEVER received a reply, which in my book is pretty disqualifying for a webshop.

Jeroen on July 23, 2008 7:54 AM

As Tini said in the second comment, the ALIX series of boards may even be better than the Jetway board Jeff mentioned. They're a little less expensive ($100-$130, depending on configuration) and have the memory soldered onto the board. They also sell nice custom compact cases for them, too. I plan on building a Linux-based firewall on the Alix 2c3 (3 LAN) board.

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Cheers!

Alex on July 23, 2008 8:00 AM

On my list of projects to start (which I never seem to finish) I have build a mini-itx car stereo. It will have a hard disk, SD card reader, USB port, dimable LEDs/display, display album art while player and a user interface that isn't completely stupid. Oh and after renting a Cadillac last week I decided that the radio should stay on after the car is shut off until the door is opened.

My biggest concern is boot up time.

mccoyn on July 23, 2008 8:06 AM

I always wanted to try getting a small, low power PC and installing it in the trunk of my car, then filling a harddrive with several hundred gigabytes of mp3's for my listening pleasure. The only issue is the monitor, but I believe it's possible to setup something like a Palm Pilot to control playing those.

With iPods these days, this idea is probably a bit dated. But I'd still like to try.

Kris on July 23, 2008 8:13 AM

How much power does it use when 100% CPU loaded?

I don't care about power usage when idle. I don't own any idle computer.

Nicolas on July 23, 2008 8:18 AM

The main downside of the Atom Jeff mentions in the first reply is that the chipset will draw an enormous amount of power compared to the CPU (http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/intel-atom-cpu,1947-4.html). I was looking for an Atom to build a low power NTP server, but the only available Atom in the Netherlands at that time was the N270 mounted at that Intel 945 motherboard. I wanted to combine that motherboard with a CF2IDE adapter, a 1GB CompactFlash card and as less memory as possible, but after some searching I found out that combination would use 30w, which is not what I consider 'low-power'.

Alex Kamsteeg. on July 23, 2008 8:21 AM

I worked for a company that produced a webcam using the PC104 form factor. Unfortunately it was overpriced and we hardly sold any. However the possibilities looked great.

The only thing we really did well out of was selling it to a company that in turn was producing hardware for TrafficMaster - which does numberplate recognition on the UK's roads.

Paul Morriss on July 23, 2008 8:41 AM

You could pick up a laptop hard drive, but another clever thing about this board is that it allows you to use a cheap CompactFlash card as your storage medium -- for the optimal low power, no moving parts install.

Unfortunately, CF isn't very robust for this type of application. The commercial grade versions, which are used for cameras et al, can get corrupted during power failures. It used to be that you could get an industrial grade version that could handle this type of thing, but I think they did away with those some time ago.

I guess my assumption was that you'd run some form of Windows on it, XP Embedded (XPe), for instance. Normnal NTFS would wear out a CF or SD pretty quickly.

Coleman on July 23, 2008 8:43 AM

Very, very cool. Dell better get on the stick -- with energy prices the way they are, these will be full mainstream in a couple of years.

John Pirie on July 23, 2008 8:44 AM

We're using the ALIX.3C2 for mesh network nodes. It draws a little too much power to run off a reasonably sized solar panel, but for our situation (a city with plenty of power) it works great. And if we get sick of the hardware, we can switch to another x86 board with little or no changes to the software!

I'm excited that x86 is making its way into the embedded market. It just brings us closer to the day when your fridge is running Linux, Zero-config'ing with the toaster.

Scott on July 23, 2008 8:51 AM

I think I'd build my own portable computer. Maybe something like a laptop, but more modular--or a backpack (fanny pack?) computer that delivers news/email/penny arcade comics to my 80's chic VR headset while I walk around town bumping into telephone poles, etc. God, I'm going to be so cool.

steveth45 on July 23, 2008 8:54 AM

obviously you have not heard of http://www.mini-box.com/
where they have tons of this stuff!!!

someguy on July 23, 2008 8:59 AM

Jeff,
I have been running OpenDomain for a few years to help out open source projects and we were recently featured on Linux.com . If you or anyone here want to use the domain http://0pc.com - please contact me.
Of course we also have http://Free.TV if anyone want to chase down the Media center angle

Ric on July 23, 2008 9:01 AM

the website is terrible, but this company also has a couple cool ideas:
http://www.kohltek.com/html/dfi_technology.html

I like the 15 touchscreen using a P4 chip, or the wall mount. I can see several of those around my (future) smart-home.

dave on July 23, 2008 9:02 AM

Jeff,

Leopard was my idea just before I read your initial comment. That is too cool...

Now, all is needed would be the touch interface and a cellular module. It's not iPhone, it's myPhone!


Maybe that's the direction Apple is heading: http://www.iht.com/articles/2008/07/22/business/apple.php

In the article there is mention of:
Apple is widely expected to be getting ready to refresh its line of notebook computers, and there is some speculation that it may introduce a new kind of device that is smaller than a laptop but larger than an iPhone. In several ways, Apple executives hinted that this new product would compete aggressively on price with rival devices.

Who knows, only Apple does.

John Baughman on July 23, 2008 9:06 AM

I discovered Mini-ITX a few years back, and back then for 200 I managed to build a mini server for my house. It consists of:

-Mini ITX Motherboard with 500Mhz VIA processor
-512MB RAM
-Full-size HDD, 320GB
-Slimline CD drive (always disconnected)

It struggles a bit when I'm trying to update software on it, but it does its job admirably. The power supply for the unit provides 60W MAX.

Maybe one day an upgrade will be in order for something tiny like this, a few years back my box was mid-range in the Mini-ITX market and Nano-ITX was off in the distance.

I can't wait to see what's coming.

Donk on July 23, 2008 9:08 AM

I have always been a fan of Soekris Engineering (http://www.soekris.com/) hardware which is great for router/firewall/wifi hotspot applications.

Joe Crotty on July 23, 2008 9:17 AM

I'd probably combine it with an old laptop screen to make my own digital picture frame that would automatically update itself with the latest pictures from my friend's accounts on flickr and Picasa Web Albums.

Graham Stewart on July 23, 2008 9:27 AM

I've been looking for an extremely low power desktop or laptop than can still do programming (especially java and flash). Will this run those without trouble?

Someone mentioned it's just for geekiness, not true! My search is because I will be living in an off-grid area. I would truly appreciate another article further researching this subject as it is near and dear to my heart :)

Cybercat on July 23, 2008 9:32 AM

I come to expect better from you. Hey, theres this cool hardware, that I've never tried... No insights, no review, waste of time. You could repeat this post on about 20 different kinds of hardware and it would all be the same.

Ian on July 23, 2008 10:01 AM

If this could do 1080p HD Video streamed over a wired network, I'd be sold. Alas, I'm still waiting for the sub $200 micro PC that can do that, is 100% hackable, and has no freaking fans.

Bryan Murphy on July 23, 2008 10:17 AM

While it's not a nani-ITX, I use one of Jetway's Mini-ITX machines (J7F3E-PB) as a carputer. The power consumption was something I worried about before I installed the system (could put a strain on the alternator) but it's run without a hitch for almost a year now.

James Miller on July 23, 2008 10:18 AM

I would combine it with a touchscreen to create a nice wall calendar that you can write notes on that it backs up to some central server. You could have multiple calendars all around the house and at your office that contain all the same information, synced in a central location.

Eric Kibbee on July 23, 2008 10:26 AM

Just a slight issue with one of your comments, Jeff:
You could pick up a laptop hard drive, but another clever thing about this board is that it allows you to use a cheap CompactFlash card as your storage medium -- for the optimal low power, no moving parts install.
Thats not actually correct. On paper, yes an SSD seems lower power than a laptop HDD, however thats comparing maximum power states to each other. HDD vary there power using, and in practice almost never even reach peak power. However, SSD's have basically two modes, on and off, so it is always consuming its max power, which is much higher than even a desktop's hard drive at idle to mid power. So in practice SSD's use more juice than HDD's, though this could change with advances in tech of course.

Meis on July 23, 2008 10:40 AM

Awesome.

Useful for making toy robots perhaps?

brian on July 23, 2008 10:48 AM

a complete windows xp auto-formats auto-partition auto-install quiet mode that lets you just plug in to a friend's ethernet slot and say go watch a movie while it does just that over network boot.

Double K on July 23, 2008 10:49 AM

I used a mini-ITX based PC in my Carputer (http://www.strifestrips.com/MavLab/index.aspx) back when I was actively working on it (2002 - 2005)

The size and power usage are perfect for building into your car! Imagine voice command for navigation, playing music, automatically recording fuel usage for each trip (tied into GPS tracking)

It was a fun project to work on - but I just don't have the spare time or drive (pun not itended) to develop it any further now.

Peter Bridger on July 23, 2008 11:36 AM

More so related to an HTPC, but the AppleTV is worth mentioning. It doesn't serve all purposes, but when the power consumption it's quite incredible. During general use and idle it consumes around 15watts, and when playing a 720p video over a wired network (wifi off) it uses around 17watts. It's a great price if you can deal with the limitations (no 1080p) and you don't mind a little bit of a hack (simple as a USB thumb drive that automatically installs what you need).

I'm certainly not saying it's a replacement for a more general purpose system, but for an off the shelf solution it's a great deal.

Samuel Stauffer on July 23, 2008 11:56 AM

Have you seen this bad-boy? Only 3.5 wide and kicks the crap out of many Mini-ITX boards. Only 21 Watts at idle. I use this in my car...

http://www.globalamericaninc.com/Embedded_Controllers-3.5_inch-Core_2_Duo/c213_214_301/p3308260/3308260_-_Wide_Temperature_3.5%22_Embedded_Controller_with_Socket_P_for_Intel_Core_Core_2_Duo/product_info.html


* 3.5 Embedded Controller with Socket P for Intel Core 2 Duo / Core Duo Processor, FSB 800 MHz
* SO-DIMM Socket for up to 2.0 GB of DDR2 SDRAM
* Intel 965GME and ICH8M Chipsets
* Mini-PCI Socket for Expansion
* EIDE and two SATA controllers
* DUAL Intel 82573l 10/100/1000 LAN
* Two High Speed Serial Ports, Six USB 2.0, IrDA
* Compact Flash Type II Socket for up to 8 GB
* 7.1 channel Realtek ALC888 HD Audio Codec
* 40.77 Watts is the typical power consumption, Idle: 21.07 Watts
* W: 5.75 x D: 4.0 x H: 0.72 (W: 146 mm x D: 102 mm x H: 18.2 mm)
* Integrated Intel Graphics Media Accelerator X3100

Jeremy on July 23, 2008 12:11 PM

I built a mini-ATX machine based on Intel's D201GLY2 in a big groovy lunchbox from India:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/76631079@N00/2138569562/

It idles at 35W, and it's been patiently running in my closet for the last six months (I actually put a quieter Noctua 120mm fan in the lid). Other than rebooting for the occasional Xubuntu upgrade, it happily chugs along, downloading torrents, acting as a Tor relay node, and running SETI@home. I've been meaning to use MisterHouse on it to do some home automation (nice that it has usb and serial both). There's now an Atom-based version of the mobo, which is quite tempting, I have to say (I'd love to get under 10W total, and most of that would be the SATA HD).

Toby on July 23, 2008 12:16 PM

None of these boards is as good as recycling an old laptop for most projects.

Cheap/free, small form factor, built in keyboard/mouse/screen and of course very low power. Environmentally it's better to recycle than make something new too.

The cost of these low power boards alone, especially if you want a special low power PSU and small case is ridiculous. The extra initial outlay more than outweighs the extra electricity used by an underclocked Sempron system, and environmentally the recycled laptop wins, especially if it would otherwise be scrapped (broken screen etc).

MoJo on July 23, 2008 12:23 PM

Hm, m0n0wall/smoothwall/pfSense/etc?
Peoples complaint with such systems always seems to be that it's a waste of power to run a full machine to do (almost) the same as a silent, low power consumer router.
I've no idea how much power an average router uses, but I imagine it's not far of what the *-ITX boards draw, and they are more than fast enough to run any of those router-OS's..

Jason Richardson/If a CF card has wear protection is it suitable as a boot device?

Yes. While CF cards will probably not last as long as a decent, regular hard-drive, the limited number of read/writes will probably never be an issue.
The cards will have improved since that (largely speculative) complaint first came up. For example, my camera uses CF cards, I have about 2 I use, and have taken around over 15,000 photos with them (and transfered them to a computer - sometimes several times), and both are still working perfectly.

Add to that the fact they cost like 10 now, and it would be incredibly trivial to clone the CF card every few months as a backup, and equally easy to replace it.. Plus the router OS's I mentioned above are designed to be run of CF cards, so only really read/write when necessary (booting, saving settings, storing logs)

dbr on July 23, 2008 12:31 PM

I'm just being a pedantic asshole, but the concept of ten times less is a bit confusing to me. I'm guessing in this case it's 1/10th.

When somebody says Foo has 10 times more X than Bar I think that Foo has 10 (or 11, depending on who I'm talking to) Bars worth of X. So when I see ten times less I'm inclined to think of negative 10 (or negative 9), which would be truly astonishing power consumption.

Whether it's 11/9 or 10/10 is about the same as the difference between people who indicate you have something on your face to wipe off via mirror-image vs. by rubbing their right to correspond to Messy-Face's right.

Ens on July 23, 2008 12:47 PM

network booting thin client perhaps, for use with LinuxMCE? don't know if it has the stones to render the video, but if so, could be pretty sweet to duck-tape to the back of a display...

James on July 23, 2008 12:58 PM

I'm thinking of gutting a ps-one case and building myself a PC into it. I'll use the PS ONE as a firewall. I'll run my internet connection through my playstation console.

CF on July 23, 2008 1:38 PM

Naturally, you won't get barn-burning performance, but if you remember the Pentium II 300 Mhz systems of yesteryear, you'll know what to expect. You may recall those now-ancient boxes were still able to do some pretty amazing things in their day. I would not build an ultra-lower power PC assuming it will be tolerable for day-to-day web browsing and email reading, unless you're comfortable using text mode or command-line interfaces exclusively.

My first HTPC was a PII-300 with 128mb of ram and a 40gb drive. Ran DivX fine. Now of course I have an ancient AMD TBird 1600+ with a gig of ram and tb of hdd.

Graham Reeds on July 23, 2008 1:46 PM

surely if your wanting it as a media center type box you need to wait a couple of years so these size machines will support 1080p through hdmi or something similar.

pete on July 23, 2008 1:55 PM

Hehe, those cuties eat around 5 watts? Let's assume, a regular desktop uses 150 watts, that way, we can have around 20 of those cuties + some switch in order to connect those cuties into a big distributed system.

And now, we can start thinking: Can this distributed system of like 20 tiny computers get faster than the desktop that uses 150 Watts? :)

And getting even more into the geek-domain, think about extending this into some sort of hive-system, with jobs being assigned around, small cuties going to powerless sleep, being woken up again and such. Mm, I want that. :)


Greetings.

Hk on July 24, 2008 3:12 AM

I'm getting more excited about the beagleboard (www.beagleboard.org)

$150 gets you a SoC that pulls less than 1W, and the entire rig can be powered off a USB socket.

That said, it is all ARM, so Windows is out.

The new ARM stuff looks *very* interesting though - much closer to a modern processor than an older style ARM (like the ARM9).

The chip also has 3d accel + a DSP to do video decoding etc.

The Pandora (which I'm also interested in) is pretty much exactly the same, but in handheld form (www.openpandora.org)

Andrew Shuttlewood on July 24, 2008 3:28 AM

What I'd like to see:

Via EPIA NX board:

http://www.via.com.tw/en/products/mainboards/motherboards.jsp?motherboard_id=470

With Via's new Nano CPU:

http://www.via.com.tw/en/products/processors/nano/

By all reports, the EPIA processors are a tad too underpowered to play full HD content despite the purported GPU support. The CPU can only handle about 720p IIRC at 100% load. The Nano should be able to handle 1280p handily.

Sandro on July 24, 2008 3:38 AM

Another interesting Atom based pc is the Ripple Mini Chocolate: http://www.myripple.co.kr/product/ripple_chocolet_red.asp http://aving.net/usa/news/default.asp?mode=readc_num=94423C_Code=02SP_Num=0mn_name=

It's a mini-itx form factor and comes with a decent looking case for around $200

I can't find power consumption details, but I imagine it won't be ultra low since it has a hard drive and optical disk, but you could probably modify those.

Giles on July 24, 2008 3:52 AM

I too would like to see the nano. I have an VIA ME6000 passive mini ITX box at the moment. It sits beneath the TV in a Silverstone LC09 box (high WAF factor) turned off most of the time. When it's time to record a show it turns on automatically (via BIOS timing function), boots over the net from a NSLU2, records the show using a Hauppauge PVR 250 back to the root NFS mounted NSLU2 and switches off again. Can't get much lower power than that.

For playback I used to use the ME6000 output to the TV but playback performance has got a bit choppy recently (Mythtv under debian testing; I've probably installed too much extra stuff on it). So I use my PC with a windows client I found somewhere.

zmower on July 24, 2008 4:37 AM

Really do not see the point!

Simon on July 24, 2008 5:26 AM

To be honest, even if this low-power system is cool, I don't see any real usage for it. It can't be used as a multimedia center since it's too slow to play HD and it doesn't have a DVI/HDMI port. Nor it can't be used as a NAS (Network Attached Storage) server since it doesn't have SATA ports (all new big hard-disks are on SATA).

Cristian on July 24, 2008 6:48 AM

How much longer before someone fabs the entire computer -- CPU, memory controller, graphics core, south-bridge (and all connectivity features), etc -- onto a single integrated circuit? You could probably get the whole thing so small that the limiting factor would be connector ports for power, USB, audio, etc.

parvenu74 on July 24, 2008 8:51 AM

Wow. Almost as low power as my good old LinkSys NSLU2 media server which is 3 Watts. These have been about for years and are very cheap and with a hacked (Unslung) BIOS will run loads of Linux programs.

http://www.nslu2-linux.org/wiki/FAQ

Chris on July 24, 2008 9:27 AM

Great article.
I guess I could use this as a box for OpenVPN, so I can securely use WiFi in open networks.
Regards,
Sebastian

Sebastian on July 24, 2008 9:36 AM

Wow, people have mentioned hackintoshes, iPhones, the rumored new small Apple device, but no love for the a href=http://www.apple.com/macmini/specs.htmlMac Mini/a? 6.5 square, 20-30 watts power use (idle/load), a significantly better CPU? Anyone?

Citizen Z on July 24, 2008 9:46 AM

Blah. Sorry: http://www.apple.com/macmini/specs.html

Citizen Z on July 24, 2008 9:46 AM

How about a little ARM9-based card that consumes about half a watt:
http://www.embeddedarm.com/products/board-detail.php?product=TS-7260
or
http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS2304885763.html

all comes with USB, ethernet etc. Jeff, you'll have to dump windows and start learning how to code small, fast, efficient Linux code instead. You might be surprised how good it is.

AndyB on July 24, 2008 9:48 AM

I just picked up a Fit-PC which uses the AMD Geode and what might be the same board illustrated above. I found it at http://www.fit-pc.com/new/ for US $300+shipping. It's a complete system running within that 5W power threshold, with I think a 60GB notebook drive, 256MB RAM, video + audio + 2 USB + 2 Ethernet, comes with Ubuntu 7.10 and Gentoo Linux pre-loaded, perfectly silent. It actually runs X/Gnome tolerably, to my surprise, though it's unsurprisingly a bit sluggish as a desktop.

I'm planning to load some different software (FreeBSD or NetBSD) and use it as a bridging firewall; the 2 Ethernet ports are perfect for that.

Sorry to the MAC mini fans just above, but this thing is $300 and consumes 5W running *fully loaded*; that's half the price and 1/6 the power of a mini. I think that's worth noting. The mini has definite virtues but they're different.

Clifton on July 24, 2008 12:36 PM

By the way, that Alex post above sure smells like spam to me; at the very least, the wording is strongly reminiscent of a lot of email spam I get about outsourcing and the domain name seems awfully like a lot of spam-style obfuscated domains.

Clifton on July 24, 2008 12:39 PM

I've used VIA EPIA motherboard to build dual-tuner DVR box running Linux and VDR. It doesn't have very powerful processor, but there's hardware MPEG2 decoder which takes almost all load.

HV on July 24, 2008 1:06 PM

As many mentioned before I'd slap in a bunch of NICs and build a cheapo router/firewall (pfSense!) ... or connect an hard disk and have a NAS (www.freenas.org anyone?)

agnul on July 24, 2008 1:52 PM

@krog/Norhtec
The Norhtec Ultra Client comes with a power supply.
I am using mine as a gateway.
The only time that it is rebooted is to apply OS/AV patches.
It is very quiet as it's fanless - uses the case as a heat sink.
http://www.norhtec.com/

KittyM16 on July 25, 2008 6:42 AM

Add 512mb of ram, a mini-pci 802.11b card, a decent sized hard drive, and a touch screen, and you have an excellent car stereo system. Running a stripped-down version of Win2k or XP, and a simplified skin on top of foobar2000 (or Linux/X/some tiny window manager/some tiny skinnable player, if you're a masochist). If the audio quality is too low, add a Creative SB X-Fi USB external audio card. If you really want to play CD's, add a low profile slot-load cd drive. Should wind up costing around the same as a decent audio deck, but you get to take your whole MP3 collection with you.

Jeremiah Miller on July 28, 2008 3:01 AM

Still I'm waiting to get my hands on Terminator CPU taken from Arnold Schwarzenegger's head. With that I could do some serious mobile computing.

Being actually the brain of a Conservative, it may not be all that green, but just think of the embedded applications!

Vadim on July 29, 2008 5:39 AM

I gotta say the new MSI mini-ITX Montevina based system looks like a winner:

This from the mini-itx.com website.

MS-9818 Specifications

* Supported processors: 45nm Socket P Intel Mobile Core 2 Duo/Celeron processors
* FSB: 1066/800/667 MHz
* Chipset: Intel GM45 North Bridge;Intel ICH9M-E South Bridge (with integrated TPM)
* Memory: 2x DDR2 800/667MHz SO-DIMM (up to 4GB max RAM)
* Graphics: Intel GMA X4500 Graphics with DirectX 10 support
* Display Outputs: VGA, DVI-D, HDMI, LVDS
* Audio: Realtek ALC888 5.1 Channel HD Audio; 6W Class-D Amplifier
* LAN: 2x Gigabit LAN ports (82567LM 82574L)
* Storage:4x SATA II with RAID 0/1/5/10; 1x 44pin IDE
* Peripheral Connectivity: 4x USB 2.0 ports + 4x additional USB 2.0 headers; 1x RS-232/RS-422/RS-485 + 5x additional COM headers
* Expansion: 1x PCI; 1x Mini PCIe; 1x PCIe x1; 1x Compact Flash (underneath board)


I think even with the somewhat slow X4500 graphics this would do just fine as a Vista Media Center PC. Better probably than the AMD 780G based platform because of power consumption. Maybe the X4500 is not as good a GPU but good enough.

Louis on July 29, 2008 11:55 AM

Thank you for talking about the CherryPal C100. I am linking to this page from my blog, CherryPal for Everyone, at cherrypal dot blogspot dot com. I am excited about how the CherryPal can bridge barriers to people who have not had access to computers or the internet because of money, fear, education or other challenges. I will be commenting on my experience of using it on my blog as soon as I get my own CherryPal C100! You can use CODE CPP206 to get your own CherryPal for $10 less than purchase price at Paypal http://cherrypal.blogspot.com

Solmn on August 3, 2008 4:52 AM

hmm so your happy to talk about
Building Tiny, Ultra Low Power PCs
In previous posts, I've talked about building your own desktop PC, and building your own home theater PC.
a long as its not PPC SOC based as per my fully informed post that got deleted?, that says a lot about your motives here.

your also very happy to advocate the beagleboard (a href=http://beagleboard.orghttp://beagleboard.org/a)">http://beagleboard.org/a)">http://beagleboard.orghttp://beagleboard.org/a) but dont want people to know about the Efika
even though the cherypal is exactly the same board but without the x86 emulation firmware (so as to be able to use any generic PCI x86 cards) that genesi made and have put on all their boards over the years....

the beagleboard (a href=http://beagleboard.orghttp://beagleboard.org/a)">http://beagleboard.org/a)">http://beagleboard.orghttp://beagleboard.org/a) which is $149 and includes a somewhat beefier processor. However, you would have trouble making it yourself..”

you cant be seriously advocting the BB , when for an extra $50 you can get a fully made developer _dual core_ 400Mhz Genesi development board of a MPC5123 PPC system reference design at $199, cheaper than the cherryPC by all acounts, and with an intigrated gfx chipset included.
User-programmable 32-bit RISC multimedia core operating at up to 200 MHz
Integrated display controller supporting up to 720p (1280720) and WXGA (1366768) resolution


a href=http://www.genesi-usa.com/press.php?date=20080414http://www.genesi-usa.com/press.php?date=20080414/a">http://www.genesi-usa.com/press.php?date=20080414/a">http://www.genesi-usa.com/press.php?date=20080414http://www.genesi-usa.com/press.php?date=20080414/a

a href=http://media.freescale.com/phoenix.zhtml?c=196520p=irol-newsArticleID=1128581highlight=http://media.freescale.com/phoenix.zhtml?c=196520p=irol-newsArticleID=1128581highlight=/a">http://media.freescale.com/phoenix.zhtml?c=196520p=irol-newsArticleID=1128581highlight=/a">http://media.freescale.com/phoenix.zhtml?c=196520p=irol-newsArticleID=1128581highlight=http://media.freescale.com/phoenix.zhtml?c=196520p=irol-newsArticleID=1128581highlight=/a

“Freescale dual-core processor simplifies embedded Linux OS-based design
Power Architecture™ processor, backed by mobileGT Linux starter kit, designed to reduce cost and time-to-market for industrial applications ”

“The MPC5123, a next-generation successor to the popular MPC5200 processor, combines a Power Architecture e300 core scaling to 400 MHz with an advanced multimedia co-processor to deliver exceptional processor performance. ”

http://www.freevec.org/functions

pup on August 10, 2008 1:53 PM

The cheapest solution nowadays is of course to buy a EeePC 700. WLAN, Ethernet, 3xUSB, low power with internal UPS (the battery) makes this the ideal low-cost server. Linux comes pre-installed, installing the LAMP stack is easy. Also you don't need an external keyboard or monitor for maintenance tasks.

Cees Meijer on August 26, 2008 12:39 PM

Have you guys heard about the Stinger Small Form Factor PC?

http://www.colmek.com/stinger-small-form-factor-pc.html

I have been hearing a lot about it and have been wondering whether to evaluate one before buying several of them.

John on February 5, 2009 10:26 AM

Meis, If you read the follow up articles on Toms, they have tested some SSD's with lower MAX power than average notebood HD idle power. And they are FAST!

I have not seen any power efficiency benchmarks specifically on CF cards when used as boot devices--modern SSD benchmarks are probably not directly correlative to CF performance.

Here is a question: If a CF card has wear protection is it suitable as a boot device? Do CF cards have an underserved bad rep as boot devices because early ones had no wear protection?

Jason Richardson on February 6, 2010 10:37 PM

What about Samsung's Q1? My boss has two and loves 'em. Heck, I've played around with them, and--apart from the elevator-music default screensaver-- they're pretty wicked.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samsung_Q1

Cameron B on February 6, 2010 10:37 PM

Wow! Quite impressed!

I have 2 linksys nlsu2 devices (aka Slug - http://www.nslu2-linux.org) that I'm using mainly for file sharing, ssh remote access, webcam streaming ... I'm using linux debian on both of my slugs and I'm quite happy. Since nslu2 will go away soon (production will be stopped) I was trying to find a replacement and just found it here!

Also I'm building a robot from an old PC and this nano-itx is perfect for my next robot project!

Will this be available in Europe or only for US? Can anyone please advise where to buy this excellent hardware! Thanks.

Nelson Neves on February 6, 2010 10:37 PM

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